Bullroarer Update 35 - Beta #4 - CLOSED

[CHEBURASHKA]

A small bug:
Lore Master's trait "Fend Them Off" does not increase fire dmg at all.

[Brethwyn_EU]

War Chant no longer stuns with Charge. Neither does Fray.

Well, that's a shame. Hopefully they will revert it. I see no reason to change this.

[Plidak]

Well, that's a shame. Hopefully they will revert it. I see no reason to change this.

Pvmp is the reason. With ssg focusing more and more on pvp, we will see more such changes.
Tbf is kinda op to have multy target aoe stun /ranged

[PreemptiveRegret]

Where was it stated that PvP is the reason?
Historically class changes have excluded PvP as a consideration, I doubt that is no longer the case (generally speaking) given how much everyone cares about PvMP as a 'legitimate' activity, that is to say not at all.

[Elmagor]

Captain-General Meldún have his new home now, but how about Tyrant Bûrzgoth? Poor orc homeless now?

[FrankvdN]

New build updates are in plum.

One request as a colour blind, can you please use a more contrasted variation than purple versus plum? I had to copy the text to Word, put it on Bold, zoom in, and then I saw the tiny difference I was looking for.

Thanks!

[Kehleyr_SSG]

One request as a colour blind, can you please use a more contrasted variation than purple versus plum? I had to copy the text to Word, put it on Bold, zoom in, and then I saw the tiny difference I was looking for.

Thanks!

Fair enough! I have changed them to turquoise - I hope that helps, and we will make note of this for future!

[Elmagor]

Carn Dum instances don't have class items with sockets for Guardian and Champion? Maybe you need to add class bow with socket for that classes?

[Pewpewmidget]

Carn Dum instances don't have class items with sockets for Guardian and Champion? Maybe you need to add class bow with socket for that classes?

Wait, no socketed heavy shields or bows? That is lame.

[DoRonRon]

Well, that's a shame. Hopefully they will revert it. I see no reason to change this.

So we now we have to burn when we come across a sapper and stand around waiting OOC?

[Thorandril]

Please add a heal over time or condition cleanse to the bracing attack essence, or literally anything since we can't decide on what to do with champion that can make it better or more interesting, just nerf things we know people definitely do not like.

Also consider adding new enamels to the game. It's been like 10 years and runekeepers are still a class.

[Kaeneth]

Has anybody else noticed that the Elven Stars weapon aura seems less vibrant on BR? Like there's less shimmering/glow to it compared to live, and I don't like the change. I hope this isn't intended and gets fixed before the update.

[Strider5548]

Please add a heal over time or condition cleanse to the bracing attack essence, or literally anything since we can't decide on what to do with champion that can make it better or more interesting, just nerf things we know people definitely do not like.

Also consider adding new enamels to the game. It's been like 10 years and runekeepers are still a class.

The bracing essence is literally the worst and most nonsensical of all class essences. Champs regularly get weird/useless bonuses and it has often been that way since the very first set bonuses at level 50. I don't really think adding a HoT would make it any more appealing, probably best for everyone to just ignore it exists.

[Pewpewmidget]

Whoever thought of the champion set bonuses and essences clearly doesn't play a champion.
I had to look for the essences to know what the bracing attack one did and it's quite useless.

[CaerArianrhod]

The appearance of the Little Tundra Cup is broken:

[FrankvdN]

Fair enough! I have changed them to turquoise - I hope that helps, and we will make note of this for future!

Much appreciated! Though the turquoise looks similar to the white, it is now really more distinguishable where the new updates are. Thank you!

[Ketriana]

Has anybody else noticed that the Elven Stars weapon aura seems less vibrant on BR? Like there's less shimmering/glow to it compared to live, and I don't like the change. I hope this isn't intended and gets fixed before the update.

Yes, I'm using that weapon aura on my LM and I noticed it looked a bit different. The aura always seemed (to me) to have a faint blue/purple tint to it which was gone on BR, and it also wasn't as bright. I actually prefer the BR version but I can understand why people wouldn't like it being changed.

The appearance of the Little Tundra Cup is broken

My tunda cub was like this as well. Poor thing looked like someone had turned him inside out!

[Elwha]

Has anybody else noticed that the Elven Stars weapon aura seems less vibrant on BR? Like there's less shimmering/glow to it compared to live, and I don't like the change. I hope this isn't intended and gets fixed before the update.

Yes, I'm using that weapon aura on my LM and I noticed it looked a bit different. The aura always seemed (to me) to have a faint blue/purple tint to it which was gone on BR, and it also wasn't as bright. I actually prefer the BR version but I can understand why people wouldn't like it being changed.

100% - the updated aura on BR looks a lot better. You actually see the details of the item its applied to.

[Thorandril]

The bracing essence is literally the worst and most nonsensical of all class essences. Champs regularly get weird/useless bonuses and it has often been that way since the very first set bonuses at level 50. I don't really think adding a HoT would make it any more appealing, probably best for everyone to just ignore it exists.

good point, making a bad thing better is a bad idea.

yeah anyways please look into it, or just adding mitigations to bracing attack, similar to low cut. or adding a bleed to feral or merciful strike or literally anything because an essence that lowers our main heal by a substantial amount in return for......fervour... is not just bad, it makes the skill worse as an upgrade.

[Pewpewmidget]

good point, making a bad thing better is a bad idea.

yeah anyways please look into it, or just adding mitigations to bracing attack, similar to low cut. or adding a bleed to feral or merciful strike or literally anything because an essence that lowers our main heal by a substantial amount in return for......fervour... is not just bad, it makes the skill worse as an upgrade.

Playing a yellow champ, I can attest that this essence is beyond pointless and I would never give up my healing ability for 2 fervour pips.

[SSG_Orion]

Pvmp is the reason. With ssg focusing more and more on pvp, we will see more such changes.
Tbf is kinda op to have multy target aoe stun /ranged

While there is clearer impact in PvMP, this change is not due to PvMP. The ability was overpowered. For landscape, it is less of an issue. Once you move into instance spaces it becomes more an issue.

[GULENDUR]

Why is Chord of Salvation no longer an immediate skill? Especially in PvP, this skill is instrumental to healing.

Is there a list somewhere that shows the justification for these changes? Many of them seem arbitrary and it doesn't make sense to make massive changes to classes when mastery and power are in the process of an update.

[Elmagor]

It is true the developer has been in constant contact on Discord. He regularly explains and discusses changes there. You can check it out on Ghyniverse. Many use that channel to mention details that may or may not have been put on Bullroarer. In return, the developer usually talks about if a fix is already in place for the next Bullroarer or if there was some bug that he needs to check.

His response for Chord of Salvation is the following:

"If bMini is underperforming against other healers, that's a core output balance issue, not a lack of immediates. Minstrel is currently (and will still be) swimming in immediates."

"Keep in mind this chord change is happening concurrently with both an increase in straight healing from LIs at lvl 140 and a cleanup of PSD on healing skills."

"That said, Chord being immediate isn't going to make or break that balance, but it was contributing towards an undesirable rate of power consumption when used off cooldown (as an anim cut)"

"In which case I'm happy to hear it. Could be a bug, or even a bad comparison between different players on BR 2. If something is out of alignment between healer classes, I want to hear it."

"Also worth noting, we've walked back prior changes removing the Immediate flag, so this particular change is not guaranteed to go live. But in the long-term, we believe it's healthier to address the underlying skill flow and perceived issues that you feel make immediate cutting necessary, rather than simply allowing frequent & pervasive anim cutting to make up for deficiencies elsewhere."

In other words, bMini was unbalanced because of immediates and Chord using for shortcuts and they trying to fix that. Same was as lighting RK was broken during early Remmorchant they heavy nerf him.

[GULENDUR]

It is true the developer has been in constant contact on Discord. He regularly explains and discusses changes there. You can check it out on Ghyniverse. Many use that channel to mention details that may or may not have been put on Bullroarer. In return, the developer usually talks about if a fix is already in place for the next Bullroarer or if there was some bug that he needs to check.

His response for Chord of Salvation is the following:

"If bMini is underperforming against other healers, that's a core output balance issue, not a lack of immediates. Minstrel is currently (and will still be) swimming in immediates."

"Keep in mind this chord change is happening concurrently with both an increase in straight healing from LIs at lvl 140 and a cleanup of PSD on healing skills."

"That said, Chord being immediate isn't going to make or break that balance, but it was contributing towards an undesirable rate of power consumption when used off cooldown (as an anim cut)"

"In which case I'm happy to hear it. Could be a bug, or even a bad comparison between different players on BR 2. If something is out of alignment between healer classes, I want to hear it."

"Also worth noting, we've walked back prior changes removing the Immediate flag, so this particular change is not guaranteed to go live. But in the long-term, we believe it's healthier to address the underlying skill flow and perceived issues that you feel make immediate cutting necessary, rather than simply allowing frequent & pervasive anim cutting to make up for deficiencies elsewhere."

Thank you for this - very informative and I agree 100% that the issue right now is core output. I don't really notice it in PvE, but it's very noticeable in PvP.

[PreemptiveRegret]

It is true the developer has been in constant contact on Discord. He regularly explains and discusses changes there. You can check it out on Ghyniverse. Many use that channel to mention details that may or may not have been put on Bullroarer. In return, the developer usually talks about if a fix is already in place for the next Bullroarer or if there was some bug that he needs to check.

His response for Chord of Salvation is the following:

"If bMini is underperforming against other healers, that's a core output balance issue, not a lack of immediates. Minstrel is currently (and will still be) swimming in immediates."

"Keep in mind this chord change is happening concurrently with both an increase in straight healing from LIs at lvl 140 and a cleanup of PSD on healing skills."

"That said, Chord being immediate isn't going to make or break that balance, but it was contributing towards an undesirable rate of power consumption when used off cooldown (as an anim cut)"

"In which case I'm happy to hear it. Could be a bug, or even a bad comparison between different players on BR 2. If something is out of alignment between healer classes, I want to hear it."

"Also worth noting, we've walked back prior changes removing the Immediate flag, so this particular change is not guaranteed to go live. But in the long-term, we believe it's healthier to address the underlying skill flow and perceived issues that you feel make immediate cutting necessary, rather than simply allowing frequent & pervasive anim cutting to make up for deficiencies elsewhere."

So the the solution to bad players badly managing power is to remove the option and functionality entirely. If it wasn't just bad players you'd adjust the power values instead.

It makes you wonder why they are bringing back power mechanics at all. Why stop at this Immediate? Just remove all skills while you're at it, no power issues then.

The design philosophy in the recent wave of "balance" in Lotro is genuinely comical. I mean, why not deeply alienate players for the sake of contrived nonsense through the removal of longstanding iconic class functionality? After all...so many people play this game. It's not like I or others have played Minstrel for almost 15 years and this kind of change fundamentally pisses people off. The clear and even intuitive and instinctive unpopularity of a change doesn't mean anything.

The best part is the rationalization given though. If I was annoyed by the CoS before now I really hate it. Why don't you just come out and say we're removing all Immediates eventually so here's a mess to deal with as we build up to it? At least that wouldn't contradict itself in the same breath, unlike giving us power management back while simultaneously removing the decision making involved in said management.