Balance

[-Ben-]

Well done, Orion, for giving the creeps a well-needed buff. I'll eat my own hat and admit that you have made large and noticeable improvements. However, as mentioned by myself and others in previous threads... and this was somewhat inevitable, really - generically buffing one side over the other does very little to balance the overall gameplay; what's needed desperately is a serious delve into how individual classes perform in PVMP.

Champ is still undoubtedly a very strong class, albeit having lost it's ability to sprint endlessly, as are bears, but classes such as hunters, burglars and wardens - having seen the same - what is essentially a nerf - as champs and bears, are totally underpowered to the point where they are no joy to either play, or to fight.

This was always going to be an issue: how do you bring champs and bears, and in some cases rk's down to a level where creeps can fight them, whilst maintaining the viability of, for example, a warden.

Have you seen a reaver fight a hunter, or a weaver fight a burglar, and on the other side of the divide - a weaver attempt to fight a competent RK? It's not a pretty sight. Of course it's not realistic to expect all classes to be equally as strong in all situations in a PVP setting, but some classes such as Champ are still considerably powerful, whilst others die if a creep happens to glance in their general direction.

I think we'd all be interested to hear how you plan to align the freep classes and make each a viable option.

[Plidak]

There are ZERO MMORPG with balanced pvp.
What ppl do is to switch from meta, to meta.
You take it, or take it.

[Denthemen]

I play captain in the moors normally but unless i'm in a group its impossible to kill anything and and impossible to survive; that's for pvmp. As for trying to complete quests solo as a captain in the moors its forever long "if" I don't come upon any creeps. I just normally sit and watch as they kill me, no point in resisting my inevitable re spawn. I went east of Isendeep and killed 2 goblins, just regular ones and it took me me 4-5mins to kill two. I normally don't go red because even npc's can kill me. I don't really understand whats happening but I would rather play captain but at this point playing solo is really impractical, and groups aren't always available.

If I'm in a group I'm normally targeted and die really fast. I don't mind the creep changes and see champs and hunters as balanced, but as for captains at least make us survivable if you wont give us the DPS to kill anything. Also with the way groups want to fight it keeps captains useless. If creeps have to many its a run and gun back and forth to elites. Captains heals only are viable if im in a battle fighting right next to my opponent, so I'm also useless in that way also. I realize that this problem has less to do about captains and more with imbalance which leads to this play style for groups.

I am happy that changes are coming to the more and that Orion is doing something about it. Also when you upgrade items I understand the swap out of the old item but the comm price on that upgrade is a ridiculous amount, especially for a class that can only really pick up wood for quests.

[Dranak123]

I play captain in the moors normally but unless i'm in a group its impossible to kill anything and and impossible to survive; that's for pvmp. As for trying to complete quests solo as a captain in the moors its forever long "if" I don't come upon any creeps. I just normally sit and watch as they kill me, no point in resisting my inevitable re spawn. I went east of Isendeep and killed 2 goblins, just regular ones and it took me me 4-5mins to kill two. I normally don't go red because even npc's can kill me. I don't really understand whats happening but I would rather play captain but at this point playing solo is really impractical, and groups aren't always available.

If I'm in a group I'm normally targeted and die really fast. I don't mind the creep changes and see champs and hunters as balanced, but as for captains at least make us survivable if you wont give us the DPS to kill anything. Also with the way groups want to fight it keeps captains useless. If creeps have to many its a run and gun back and forth to elites. Captains heals only are viable if im in a battle fighting right next to my opponent, so I'm also useless in that way also. I realize that this problem has less to do about captains and more with imbalance which leads to this play style for groups.

I am happy that changes are coming to the more and that Orion is doing something about it. Also when you upgrade items I understand the swap out of the old item but the comm price on that upgrade is a ridiculous amount, especially for a class that can only really pick up wood for quests.

Hi...i have a midranked cappy that i used to duo with a champ on. I agree with the bulk of what you say. My solution is really whacky and nuts....take one piece of gear be it cloak/shield/standard and put some penalties and buffs in it to retune the cappy and make it a 140 level moors only piece.
So.....-40% outgoing healing , -10 mitigations , +10% crit rating , +100% damage (50 in reality) , +10% finesse crit def resistance.
This is so ludicrous you have to laugh. The real tragedy is even were this to happen you would still be mediocre.
The best advice is run the cappy in high survivability mode for large groups ( they will want your grave wound inc heal debuff if nothing else ) and get another alt prepped for solo moors use.

[b4jet9597]

I play captain in the moors normally but unless i'm in a group its impossible to kill anything and and impossible to survive; that's for pvmp. As for trying to complete quests solo as a captain in the moors its forever long "if" I don't come upon any creeps. I just normally sit and watch as they kill me, no point in resisting my inevitable re spawn. I went east of Isendeep and killed 2 goblins, just regular ones and it took me me 4-5mins to kill two. I normally don't go red because even npc's can kill me. I don't really understand whats happening but I would rather play captain but at this point playing solo is really impractical, and groups aren't always available.

If I'm in a group I'm normally targeted and die really fast. I don't mind the creep changes and see champs and hunters as balanced, but as for captains at least make us survivable if you wont give us the DPS to kill anything. Also with the way groups want to fight it keeps captains useless. If creeps have to many its a run and gun back and forth to elites. Captains heals only are viable if im in a battle fighting right next to my opponent, so I'm also useless in that way also. I realize that this problem has less to do about captains and more with imbalance which leads to this play style for groups.

I am happy that changes are coming to the more and that Orion is doing something about it. Also when you upgrade items I understand the swap out of the old item but the comm price on that upgrade is a ridiculous amount, especially for a class that can only really pick up wood for quests.

Roll yellow line sword and board with an RK healer and it'll take 8+ to kill you if you build capped mits, and capped crit. Yellow/red/blue for grave wound/telling mark, and good rez for large raids with no designated red cappy. Or Yellow/blue for heals when in small groups with good dps or large raids with a designated red cappy.

Red just isn't what it used to be sadly.

[Breguilas]

Well done, Orion, for giving the creeps a well-needed buff. I'll eat my own hat and admit that you have made large and noticeable improvements. However, as mentioned by myself and others in previous threads... and this was somewhat inevitable, really - generically buffing one side over the other does very little to balance the overall gameplay; what's needed desperately is a serious delve into how individual classes perform in PVMP.

Champ is still undoubtedly a very strong class, albeit having lost it's ability to sprint endlessly, as are bears, but classes such as hunters, burglars and wardens - having seen the same - what is essentially a nerf - as champs and bears, are totally underpowered to the point where they are no joy to either play, or to fight.

This was always going to be an issue: how do you bring champs and bears, and in some cases rk's down to a level where creeps can fight them, whilst maintaining the viability of, for example, a warden.

Have you seen a reaver fight a hunter, or a weaver fight a burglar, and on the other side of the divide - a weaver attempt to fight a competent RK? It's not a pretty sight. Of course it's not realistic to expect all classes to be equally as strong in all situations in a PVP setting, but some classes such as Champ are still considerably powerful, whilst others die if a creep happens to glance in their general direction.

I think we'd all be interested to hear how you plan to align the freep classes and make each a viable option.

Recently I have seen people get hit by the freep tactical dmg classes, especially rks and minstrels, where epic conclusion hits for 3mil and minor ballads and coda hit for 300-400k on a maxed-out-mitigations target. Something seems off with that

[SSG_Orion]

I think we'd all be interested to hear how you plan to align the freep classes and make each a viable option.

First, there is no reason to be eating hats. I am sure that it would wreak havoc on your intestines. Second, since you are interested.

The changes that we've been making on the back end provides us more flexibility to tweak the balance in shorter timeframes. The future of gear in the Ettenmoors, is likely to make the continued "balance" even easier to maintain.

Not going to lie, it has been an eventful year, and we are just starting to turn the corner into stage 3. It's nice to know that things are starting to even out again.

[DSBoomer]

First, there is no reason to be eating hats. I am sure that it would wreak havoc on your intestines. Second, since you are interested.

The changes that we've been making on the back end provides us more flexibility to tweak the balance in shorter timeframes. The future of gear in the Ettenmoors, is likely to make the continued "balance" even easier to maintain.

Not going to lie, it has been an eventful year, and we are just starting to turn the corner into stage 3. It's nice to know that things are starting to even out again.

Don't worry, I would've responded to the 5 month old post too. You know, the one that said you did something right instead of the one pointing out the obvious CURRENT issue that needs fixed post haste. The one that is definitely going to kill the moors if it continues unchecked.

Recently I have seen people get hit by the freep tactical dmg classes, especially rks and minstrels, where epic conclusion hits for 3mil and minor ballads and coda hit for 300-400k on a maxed-out-mitigations target. Something seems off with that