Boxing + Farming Should Require Multiple *Subscriptions*

[Hurin]

But you are asking me to stop going to a specific region that YOU don't have authority to do so. MR "SSG".

Really, though. Nobody should have to ask you on patch day when the server is melting down around everyone. It's a shame it doesn't occur to you on your own.

I already said it is highly unlikely that I am causing the lag but here you are stating that I'm causing the lag

Where?

Now you are asking when will it break? I don't know this information, maybe you can point out the stress stresshold of the server. MR. "SSG".

Nope, I asked that, past tense, about the update 20 launch day incident: At the time on launch day when the server was redlining and melting, just how many more single person fellowships and raids do you think it would have been smart to bring in there? In addition to your own, of course! Heaven forbid you not bring your six at such a time!

There are no rules regarding items acquisition. MR "SSG". Yes it is mine, MR "SSG".

Let's get out of this conformity that multiboxer, item acquisition is illegal. Mr. "SSG" you obviously didn't write the TOS, EULA. MR "SSG".

Stop pretending to be SSG. I think that is part of the forum rules right? MR. "SSG" is you by the way not the real boss OK?

I think your keyboard might be broken and you keep accidentally pasting "MR. 'SSG'" throughout your sentences. It makes it even harder to fathom what you're saying.

--H

[watevaplz]

The original post isn't really talking about that type of boxer, though, is it?

The original post talk about lag caused by multiboxers which is your underlying concern because you base it on Hypothetical Future that multiboxers will take 50% of "SSG's resources".

Like Beanie already mentioned within the span of 10 years this "Hyperbole aka Hypothetical Future" will more likely not gonna happen. Unless of course you want more time to "verify" this information, and it is not HINDSIGHT(LOL).

I made examples of how multiboxers "spawn farms" didn't effect the lag that was caused in North Ithilien prior U20 because I'm certain there was none in North Ithilien . I made a recent example of my multibox accounts not lagging in The Waste, not lagging here at all.

So this problem is still base on a hypothetical "future" that you require more time with? I just want to know timeline of 5-10 more years give or take. So I can get back to this forum post and say "hindsight? fair enough for you?

[Hurin]

The original post talk about lag caused by multiboxers which is your underlying concern because you base it on Hypothetical Future that multiboxers will take 50% of "SSG's resources".

Like Beanie already mentioned within the span of 10 years this "Hyperbole aka Hypothetical Future" will more likely not gonna happen. Unless of course you want more time to "verify" this information, and it is not HINDSIGHT(LOL).

I made examples of how multiboxers "spawn farms" didn't effect the lag that was caused in North Ithilien prior U20 because I'm certain there was none in North Ithilien . I made a recent example of my multibox accounts not lagging in The Waste, not lagging here at all.

So this problem is still base on a hypothetical "future" that you require more time with? I just want to know timeline of 5-10 more years. I can get back to this forum post and say "hindsight? fair enough for you?

I'm going to give you a tip for free. I know you think you are getting in some "sick burns" by quoting "hypothetical" and "hindsight" and "hyperbole" over and over again and peppering them throughout your posts for page after page. But, well, you don't apparently understand those words well enough to actually make those blows "land". . . it's just confusing and awkward. And it just makes me feel sorta bad for you.

As for that 50% number you also bring up over and over again that you clearly do not understand (despite a prior apologist for your side saying that the illustrative example in which I mentioned it was "well stated" and was thus satisfied enough to leave the discussion). . . as you've been told, it was not to be taken literally and was illustrative. But, as those who argue disingenuously tend to do, you continue to insist on taking it literally. I suppose that's easier than actually substantively and cogently addressing what I'm saying.

--H

[Hurin]

Here's that post

-------------------------------------------------------

You with six clients = 1 person enjoying the game.
Six people with one client each = 6 people enjoying the game.

It's not a question of "single players being more important". . . it's a simple question of them being six people and you being one. "Importance" doesn't enter into it.

As already stated. . .

The overall goal is to make sure that this situation. . .

one player x 1 client
vs
one player x 6 clients

Doesn't scale out to

600 players x 1 client = 600 clients
100 players x 6 clients = 600 clients
-----------------------------------------
= 100 players using 50% of SSG's resources

If I walk onto a subway car and spread my belongings across six seats during rush hour, it takes a certain mentality to then yell at the people giving me the stink eye. And that analogy doesn't even take into account that I'm (somehow) using those six seats to generate something of benefit to me.

--------------------------------------------------------

Everyone else after reading that post: "Oh I see what he's getting at. I may not agree. But it's a reasonably expressed."

You after reading that post: "How do you know it is 50%!?! Oh, you mean in the future? You mean HYPOTHETICAL!?! HYPERBOLE HYPOTHETICAL!?! MR. SSG. 50%. Hyperbole! Hypothetical! Mr. SSG!""

[watevaplz]

I'm going to give you a tip for free. I know you think you are getting in some "sick burns" by quoting "hypothetical" and "hindsight" and "hyperbole" over and over again and peppering them throughout your posts for page after page. But, well, you don't apparently understand those words well enough to actually make those blows "land". . . it's just confusing and awkward. And it just makes me feel sorta bad for you.

--H

It is clearly your foundation with this post (HYPOTHETICAL FUTURE). You defended it with great extent. You even made a mathematical equation regarding the matter. The funny part is you could save a lot of time by looking at the calender in 2007 and make a LOGICAL judgement before posting such ridiculous claims. Happy New Year 2017! Welcome back to the world!

Another funny notion is that is your defense, when I point out the lag, that was caused in U20 new areas was not me nor any multiboxers I know because they are log in right now farming areas.. you call it "HINDSIGHT".

So yes I asked you again how many "FUTURE" in terms of years do I need to come back to this post to see actual fruition, so I can say "hindsight". I don't want to waste your time, nor anyone else.

PS: If this doesn't bother you, you would of not post saying it doesn't burn.

[Hurin]

Let's break it down. . .

Let's say the active player population is 10,000

Let's say there are 500 multiboxers who run fellowships gold farms. They are therefore 5% of the server population.

Let's say there are 200 multiboxers who run raid gold farms. They are therefore 2% of the server population.

The remaining population of 9,300 players represent 93% of the player population.

Now, despite bizarre resistance to this fact, the servers and datacenter have a finite amount of CPU cycles, RAM, Disk I/O, and bandwidth. And, we can all agree that the servers struggle at times. When those servers are struggling. . .

Those single people running fellowships at 5% of the player population are using as many datacenter resources as if they were 30% of the population (5% x 6 clients).

Those single people running raids at only 2% of the population are yet still able to use datacenter resources as if they were 24% of the population (2% x 12 clients).

You can argue that fellowship-sized farmers are only 2% of the population if that makes you feel better. But in a crisis, they're still going to to put load on the server as though they were 12% of the player population even though they are 2%. And that, to use a technical terms. . . sucks.

Now, of course, I fully expect you to misunderstand and misuse the point here. . . just as you bizarrely seem to think that this (or other things I've said) "blame" you for lag and that you not lagging now means you can't possible affect lag at other time (and you think that constitutes "logic"). So, I look forward to you harping on about 30% and 24% and 12% and saying "HYPOTHETICAL" and "HYPERBOLE" a lot.

But, the fact remains, when stuff goes wrong, you have a much higher impact on an already struggling server than does someone playing a single client. It astounds me the bizarre lengths you will go to and the bewildering things you will say in order to avoid acknowledging this.

With Warmest Regards,

Mr. SSG

[Hurin]

Woops, I should also point out a post made recently in another thread about how raids and fellowships by their very nature use more bandwidth, cpu cycles, RAM, and disk I/O than the equivalent number of single players outside a fellowship or raid because members of a fellowship/raid are constantly sending each other data/telemetry and such that proximate unfellowed players don't send each other. That isn't even taken into account in the model above.

That's an awfully computationally expensive mechanism for a single person to use in order to multiply the amount of loot he gets per kill by 6, 12, or 24.

Yours Truly,

Hurin (AKA Mr. SSG)

[watevaplz]

EVERYTHING YOU'VE SAID IS NOT SUPPORTED BY ANY 10 YEAR TIME LINE OF LOTRO. NOR ANY GAMES THAT ALLOW MULTIBOXING. IF THIS WAS THE CASE AND ALL OF THESE MULTIBOXER ARE THE CAUSE OF WHAT YOU DESCRIBE LAG PROBLEM, THE OVERWHELMING AMOUNT OF CORPORATIONS AND GAMING COMPANIES WILL CHANGE THEIR TOS/EULA agreements to CONFORM WITH WHAT YOU'VE SAID.

LIKE MANY MENTIONED IT ALSO A GOOD WAY TO GET MORE PLAYERS IN, SOME PLAYER LOVE TO MULTIBOX AND COUGH UP DOUGH. WOULD THEY LIMIT POTENTIAL TO THESE SETS OF PLAYERS? WOULD ANY COMPANY OUT THERE LIMIT THE USE OF THEIR PRODUCT? (except drugs and anything that adversly affect their health) THE ANSWER IS NO.

You keep repeating 6,12,24,48 96 gains of this multiboxers virtual item gains. Tell me what is LOTRO losing besides your make-belief "SSG's resources". Tell me what is the loss of all gaming companies that have the same policy regarding multiboxers. Is that none? HOORAY, MORE POTENTIAL PROFIT, HOORAY. Sounds like a good exchange to me!

[Hurin]

EVERYTHING YOU'VE SAID IS NOT SUPPORTED BY ANY 10 YEAR TIME LINE OF LOTRO. NOR ANY GAMES THAT ALLOW MULTIBOXING. IF THIS WAS THE CASE AND ALL OF THESE MULTIBOXER ARE THE CAUSE OF WHAT YOU DESCRIBE LAG PROBLEM, THE OVERWHELMING AMOUNT OF CORPORATIONS AND GAMING COMPANIES WILL CHANGE THEIR TOS/EULA agreements to CONFORM WITH WHAT YOU'VE SAID.

LIKE MANY MENTIONED IT ALSO A GOOD WAY TO GET MORE PLAYERS IN, SOME PLAYER LOVE TO MULTIBOX AND COUGH UP DOUGH. WOULD THEY LIMIT POTENTIAL TO THESE SETS OF PLAYERS? WOULD ANY COMPANY OUT THERE LIMIT THE USE OF THEIR PRODUCT? (except drugs and anything that adversly affect their health) THE ANSWER IS NO.

You keep repeating 6,12,24,48 96 gains of this multiboxers virtual item gains. Tell me what is LOTRO losing besides your make-belief "SSG's resources". Tell me what is the loss of all gaming companies that have the same policy regarding multiboxers. Is that none? HOORAY, MORE POTENTIAL PROFIT, HOORAY. Sounds like a good exchange to me!

Dear watevaplz,

On servers that are already struggling, you are putting at least six times more stress on the server than I am. So that you can multiply the loot you receive by six.

That's a fact. You can't obfuscate it with bizarre outbursts.

Love,

Hurin

P.S. I'll always be your Mr. SSG.

[watevaplz]

Dear watevaplz,

On servers that are already struggling, you are putting at least six times more stress on the server than I am. So that you can multiply the loot you receive by six.

That's a fact. You can't obfuscate it with bizarre outbursts.

Love,

Hurin

P.S. I'll always be your Mr. SSG.

But is is not struggling. I already pointed it out. It hasn't been lagging since the fix. "That's a fact".

BUT OK MR. "SSG" it is lagging if that makes you feel better ok? Now stay there lagging while this group of 48 "bots" plus my 6 with no right to be in the farming area according to you, farm.

[Hurin]

But is is not struggling. I already pointed it out. It hasn't been lagging since the fix. "That's a fact".

And when it struggles again, you'll just keep on keepin' on. Like you did on U20 launch day. You looked that server straight in its eyes and you said: "Darn it, I know you're hurting, but I gotta have my six shares of loot!"

BUT OK MR. "SSG" it is lagging if that makes you feel better ok? Now stay there lagging while this group of 48 "bots" plus my 6 with no right to be in the farming area according to you, farm.

Nah! Go right ahead! Farm away! Like you did when you knew the servers were melting on Tuesday. Even though, as I said, you're putting at least six times the stress on the server as other players are. All so you can multiply your own loot by six. But, hey, what do you care. . . you got your loot (times six!).

Best Regards,

You Know Who It Is.

[watevaplz]

And when it struggles again, you'll just keep on keepin' on. Like you did on U20 launch day. You looked that server straight in its eyes and you said: "Darn it, I know you're hurting, but I gotta have my six shares of loot!"


Nah! Go right ahead! Farm away! Like you did when you knew the servers were melting on Tuesday. Even though, as I said, you're putting at least six times the stress on the server as other players are. All so you can multiply your own loot by six. But, hey, what do you care. . . you got your loot (times six!).

Best Regards,

You Know Who It Is.

If you claims that multiboxers are the cause of the lag it should be constant. But hey logic and a process elimination is not applicable, so let's just call that hindsight.

Of course if it the lag comes back I blame all the multiboxers. If there is no lag.... hmmmm pure "illogical" coincidence. Let's call it "LUCK".

Thanks I make sure I spend it on large shrews.

[Hurin]

If you claims that multiboxers are the cause of the lag it should be constant. But hey logic and a process elimination is not applicable, so let's just call that hindsight.

Of course if it the lag comes back I blame all the multiboxers. If there is no lag.... hmmmm pure "illogical" coincidence. Let's call it "LUCK".

Thanks I make sure I spend it on large shrews.

You confuse cause with exacerbation. And you fail to understand the concept of needless exacerbation due to disproportionate utilization. But hey, keep asserting that it's all about root causes when it's obviously not. Knocking down straw men is so much easier.

Ah well, I must sleep. Or, as you call it, I must go "earn my 200 night-gold."

--H

[watevaplz]

You confuse cause with exacerbation. And you fail to understand the concept of needless exacerbation due to disproportionate utilization. But hey, keep asserting that it's all about root causes when it's obviously not. Knocking down straw men is so much easier.

Ah well, I must sleep. Or, as you call it, I must go "earn my 200 night-gold."

--H

"Your disproportionate utilization" is in question because you clearly have some weird standards that you can come up with that Multiboxers (somewhere in any timeline) will cause the server lag.

Like you insinuated that I don't have any right to be in the new area because I contribute to the lag with the release of U20. Now it is fix whatever was causing it. You had to nothing say to the cause (which is multiboxing, which surprisingly i'm in the waste no lag at all) and call it "exacerbation".

Maybe you can come log in tomorrow with funny jokes and comebacks like "HINDSIGHT" "Exacerbation"

[Tsch]

Really, though. Nobody should have to ask you on patch day when the server is melting down around everyone. It's a shame it doesn't occur to you on your own.


<snip>

Nope, I asked that, past tense, about the update 20 launch day incident: At the time on launch day when the server was redlining and melting, just how many more single person fellowships and raids do you think it would have been smart to bring in there? In addition to your own, of course! Heaven forbid you not bring your six at such a time!


<snip>
--H

Such dramatic and emotive imagery you give us of the servers.


Do you not think it better that the devs tune the servers for a realistic live load rather than an artificially lowered load?

[Gyes]

Good lord, I go to sleep for 7 hours and there are more than two new pages of wat's insipid drivel. Yipes. Hurin, you're dedicated, I'll say that much, but surely there's something better for you to be doing than arguing with him. I said it before - wat "argues" like a climate denier. He fixates on one irrelevant idea that he's misinterpreted and conveniently ignores the mountains of evidence to the contrary, and why? All so he can continue his own self-centered existence where he can continue enriching himself without acknowledging that he's doing it at the expense of others and the future. I'm not going to bother reading any more posts from or involving wat. It's just not worth it.

But here's one from someone else!

1) I honestly think SSG doesn't mind. I think they expect people to play the way they enjoy. Some like solo play, some like large groups/raids, some like boxing, some like moors, etc etc etc.

Multiboxing isn't a play style. You didn't answer whether the devs want people to multibox. Do you think they plan content with the expectation that large swaths of the population are going to log in their 12 LMs to complete it?

2) I think the likelihood of everyone else running 12 accounts simultaneously is never going to happen. I think if it did the game would adapt, however I have a much better chance of winning the lotto and I don't buy tickets.

That's a total evasion. Let me simplify it for you - is the server going to operate better with everyone running one account or everyone running 12?

3) Allowing multiboxing reaches an audience that would most likely not play otherwise. It's a kind of play they enjoy, something that gives them pleasure, which is the ultimate purpose of the game. They spend enough to make it worthwhile (I've been known to box 3 lifer accts simultaneously with 3 VIP accts I also had - now premium). Boxing makes it easier to do deeds, go through harder areas without relying on other people. I like to raid and enjoy group play up through T2C, but I'm also an introvert who at times likes to play quietly without engaging others.

This is kinda like saying "Some people like to drag race, so when someone blows past you at 100 mph in a school zone, you should just tip your hat and wave to them. They're driving the way they enjoy."

If you want to only allow types of play that *I* think adds to the quality of the game, we can immediately do away with festivals of all kinds, role play, music, housing, any kind of cosmetics or decorations, big battles and the entire trait tree system. However, because I don't think only of myself and I realize people enjoy things I don't, I keep my grumbling to a minimum (except big battles, they really stink) and get along with others. Anti-boxers might try that.

Some years ago, I was involved in passing my state's indoor smoking ban. The opposition's argument sounded a lot like yours - "Live and let live. If you don't like what we're doing, then don't do it yourself. To each his own." The problem is that you aren't letting live. Just like second-hand smoke, your actions have a negative effect on everyone around you. You actually are only thinking about yourself. Honestly - do you think you're out there with your 6 LMs earning gold or completing deeds for the benefit of the server? Boxing is about the most self-centered behavior you can engage in and if there's even the slightest negative consequence to the people around you, you shouldn't be doing it.

[Hurin]

Do you not think it better that the devs tune the servers for a realistic live load rather than an artificially lowered load?

That, in addition to your contention that boxers are entitled to greater in-game rewards because they spend more on electricity really does demonstrate that there really is nothing you folks won't tell yourselves to rationalize and justify the racket to which you've hitched yourselves.

Too funny.

[Tsch]

That, in addition to your contention that boxers are entitled to greater in-game rewards because they spend more on electricity really does demonstrate that there really is nothing you folks won't tell yourselves to rationalize and justify the racket to which you've hitched yourselves.

Too funny.

[Beaniemooch]

Multiboxing isn't a play style. You didn't answer whether the devs want people to multibox. Do you think they plan content with the expectation that large swaths of the population are going to log in their 12 LMs to complete it?

That's a total evasion. Let me simplify it for you - is the server going to operate better with everyone running one account or everyone running 12?

This is kinda like saying "Some people like to drag race, so when someone blows past you at 100 mph in a school zone, you should just tip your hat and wave to them. They're driving the way they enjoy."

Some years ago, I was involved in passing my state's indoor smoking ban. The opposition's argument sounded a lot like yours - "Live and let live. If you don't like what we're doing, then don't do it yourself. To each his own." The problem is that you aren't letting live. Just like second-hand smoke, your actions have a negative effect on everyone around you. You actually are only thinking about yourself. Honestly - do you think you're out there with your 6 LMs earning gold or completing deeds for the benefit of the server? Boxing is about the most self-centered behavior you can engage in and if there's even the slightest negative consequence to the people around you, you shouldn't be doing it.

I think SSG wants people to multibox. I think they want them to single box. Mostly I think they want people to PLAY. You're hung up on LM boxers for some reason. Broaden your horizons. Almost makes me miss the days and threads of the Brandy "OMG THERE'S A SPIDER BOXER IN THE MOORS WRECKING LIFE FOR ALL WHO EXIST EVERYWHERE".

To simplify it for YOU - I don't think it makes a difference whether everybody runs one or everybody runs 12. If everybody running one each groups up, you have the EXACT SAME LAG as those who box so basically you're saying people shouldn't group because it causes lag.

Multiboxing isn't your playstyle, however it is a preferred playstyle for some people. Most multiboxers I know (and I know quite a few) don't run LMs and don't run pet classes. They run hunters usually, or one I know runs a champ box. He used to run an RK box. I run a minstrel box when I do it, because it's fun. Yes, strange as it sounds to you, I enjoy it. It amuses me no end to see six little screaming hobbits running around shouting mobs to death. I game for fun, and amusement is key.

Drag racing is against the law except on approved tracks, and specifically there are laws regarding speed in school zones. Laws should be enforced. Multiboxing is specifically allowed by SSG so unless SSG says "no more multiboxing" your argument is just that - an argument. There is no basis of fact.

When multiboxing causes cancer I shall lobby along with you. Multiboxing or getting together with 11 other friends - even on LMs - is no different to lag or outcome. They get stuff you don't, you're irritated, and therefore because you don't like it nobody should do it. Calling me selfish because I like to run 6 little hobbit minstrels all over Middle Earth doing whatever amuses me isn't selfish - it's a hoot. In the meantime, perhaps you should lobby SSG to remove LMs from the game since that seems to be your pet peeve?

For the record, unattended gameplay even on a single character like an LM or Cappy with your pet on aggressive is against the rules. However, sitting on your computer watching Netflix while your character is performing macros while you are in front of the computer and ready to answer a GM is NOT against the rules. You may still hate it. You may still think it's unfair. You may think that person is the lowest form of life known to Middle Earth. But it's STILL NOT AGAINST THE RULES.

Peace out.

[Gyes]

I think SSG wants people to multibox. I think they want them to single box. Mostly I think they want people to PLAY. You're hung up on LM boxers for some reason. Broaden your horizons. Almost makes me miss the days and threads of the Brandy "OMG THERE'S A SPIDER BOXER IN THE MOORS WRECKING LIFE FOR ALL WHO EXIST EVERYWHERE".

Then why isn't any content designed for boxers exclusively? Why can't you control 12 characters using built-in features in the client?

To simplify it for YOU - I don't think it makes a difference whether everybody runs one or everybody runs 12. If everybody running one each groups up, you have the EXACT SAME LAG as those who box so basically you're saying people shouldn't group because it causes lag.

You think wrong. 12 times as many client connections to the server is worse for server performance. Again, 12 times as many connections. Comparing one multiboxer running 12 clients with 12 players running a raid is invalid. I asked if the server would better handle 1 connection or 12. You again evaded the question, likely because the answer is inconvenient for you.

Multiboxing isn't your playstyle, however it is a preferred playstyle for some people. Most multiboxers I know (and I know quite a few) don't run LMs and don't run pet classes. They run hunters usually, or one I know runs a champ box. He used to run an RK box. I run a minstrel box when I do it, because it's fun. Yes, strange as it sounds to you, I enjoy it. It amuses me no end to see six little screaming hobbits running around shouting mobs to death. I game for fun, and amusement is key.

Exploiting isn't a playstyle. Do you think players purposefully crashing a server to duplicate items constitutes a playstyle too?

Drag racing is against the law except on approved tracks, and specifically there are laws regarding speed in school zones. Laws should be enforced. Multiboxing is specifically allowed by SSG so unless SSG says "no more multiboxing" your argument is just that - an argument. There is no basis of fact.

Uh, doi. I'm arguing the rules should be changed. In terms of the analogy, right now there isn't a rule saying you should only drag race in approved locations and that you should drive 15 in a school zone.

When multiboxing causes cancer I shall lobby along with you. Multiboxing or getting together with 11 other friends - even on LMs - is no different to lag or outcome. They get stuff you don't, you're irritated, and therefore because you don't like it nobody should do it. Calling me selfish because I like to run 6 little hobbit minstrels all over Middle Earth doing whatever amuses me isn't selfish - it's a hoot. In the meantime, perhaps you should lobby SSG to remove LMs from the game since that seems to be your pet peeve?

Thanks for the analogy - it's spot on. Multiboxing is a cancer that needs to be excised before it's too late. It's a small group of people behaving badly and causing a variety of negative effects on the rest of the community. If left unchecked, it will eventually inundate and destroy the game. If you want to see the end result of unchecked exploitation, look at Asheron's Call. Combat macros destroyed it. Ultimately the good elements of the community left and you ended up with a bunch of robots in dungeons killing endlessly. Those macros did basically the same thing as multiboxing in this game and the devs made the same distinction - unattended was bad, "attended" (watching Netflix and listening for the GM tell, as Hurin puts it) was permitted. It didn't end well.

For the record, unattended gameplay even on a single character like an LM or Cappy with your pet on aggressive is against the rules. However, sitting on your computer watching Netflix while your character is performing macros while you are in front of the computer and ready to answer a GM is NOT against the rules. You may still hate it. You may still think it's unfair. You may think that person is the lowest form of life known to Middle Earth. But it's STILL NOT AGAINST THE RULES.

Peace out.

And that's why I'm advocating for the rules to be changed.

[Hurin]

Perhaps this was lost in the shuffle. . .

----------------------------------------

Question:

If it's so laudatory, supported, and endorsed, why are there no threads on these forums helping people get set up with the aforementioned 3rd party software that facilitates painless multiboxing/farming?

Ten years. . . not one thread with more than an off-hand reference to it in passing.

Odd. That.

--H

[Tsch]

Perhaps this was lost in the shuffle. . .

----------------------------------------

Question:

If it's so laudatory, supported, and endorsed, why are there no threads on these forums helping people get set up with the aforementioned 3rd party software that facilitates painless multiboxing/farming?

Ten years. . . not one thread with more than an off-hand reference to it in passing.

Odd. That.

--H

The only 3rd party software I employ with the game is the OS (authorized, luckily ), whence comes the very useful Alt-Tab I use when I choose to duo. Funny thing, I am as likely to box LotRO and DDO together as I am to drag along a guard to protect my supplies in caravan. XD

[watevaplz]

Perhaps this was lost in the shuffle. . .

----------------------------------------

Question:

If it's so laudatory, supported, and endorsed, why are there no threads on these forums helping people get set up with the aforementioned 3rd party software that facilitates painless multiboxing/farming?

Ten years. . . not one thread with more than an off-hand reference to it in passing.

Odd. That.

--H

Because it is against the rules to use 3rd party programs even playing solo. I know a lot of players that end up getting banned using macros in moors.

So looking back
-> Why are you still STUCK on the subject that everyone that multibox, there is a mandatory requirement that one needs 3rd party programs. Let's be clear it is not a must to have a 3rd party program/macros/bots to multibox.
-> So we are straying from subjects such as "my" contribution to the lag which the server currently don't have. Also like the stress level of the server. There is a better explanation why most of us lag. It involves bad coding, can be seen clearly seen with mounted combat, and North Ithilien prior to U20 and the very first day of The Waste. Oh great they fixed it, except mounted combat. If you rubber band all the way while in your warsteed don't blame on multiboxers.
-> The inflation that caused by multiboxers is actually not true, since they have MORE items to sell they want to sell faster and cheaper. So your "gold" have more representation especially when they start to unload these items to the market. Or unless of course every multiboxers character have a whooping 800k+ gold and somehow in a spending spree buying every single Large Shrews. Guilty on buying 20 large shrews, I be persecuted for insider trading.
-> The "good loot" you speak is gated in T2C which most multiboxer don't wanna tackle. Positioning requirements, attention to every single characters it is a must to survive these areas. I do it better and faster with my main in an actual raid group and with no headache. Unless of course you are talking areas such as the current "reputation" farm which is not gated nor stopping a solo to tag mobs and get credit for the kill and chance of loot. How does it go faster when items are not exactly a 100% drop and BoA barter items?

[Hurin]

Because it is against the rules to use 3rd party programs even playing solo. I know a lot of players that end up getting banned using macros in moors.

The vast majority of the boxers running gold farms that this thread addressed are using this program. That program has threads on its forums stating that SSG winks at it, and that its support staff (when it was Turbine) actually apologized and reinstated people "erroneously" banned for using it. Odd then that nobody talks about it here.

Why are you still STUCK on the subject that everyone that multibox, there is a mandatory requirement that one needs 3rd party programs. Let's be clear it is not a must to have a 3rd party program/macros/bots to multibox.

You have a penchant for putting words in people's mouths. I never said it was mandatory. That's nonsense. Just as I never blamed you as the cause of performance issues. Yet you repeat that over and over again as well. Because you can't address arguments that are actually being made, you address what you wish they were saying. Texbook straw men.

The inflation that caused by multiboxers is actually not true, since they have MORE items to sell they want to sell faster and cheaper. So your "gold" have more representation especially when they start to unload these items to the market. Or unless of course every multiboxers character have a whooping 800k+ gold and somehow in a spending spree buying every single Large Shrews. Guilty on buying 20 large shrews, I be persecuted for insider trading.

My god. Every economist who reads this would weep.

Yes prices go down on certain things that they farm en masse and flood the market (increasing supply decreases price).

But. . . the part you gloss over, is the tremendous amount of gold they generate both as they farm those items but also as a result of selling those items.

And those vast quantities of gold in the economy raise the price on the items that they generally don't/can't receive as a result of farming. That's the definition of inflation.

So, no, the hides that they lower the price on doesn't translate to a lower price on Anfalas Crystals, Scroll of Empowerment, Wild Essences, or other items that they then purchase with their vast quantities of multibox-farmed gold (that they worked so hard for while they watched Netflix and listened for a GM tell), but not farmed en masse themselves.

Perhaps the most dismaying part about the way that you argue is that you clearly don't take any time whatsoever to check your own arguments and instead leave it to others. Thus wasting all our time on bad arguments that you should have caught yourself before posting them.

The "good loot" you speak is gated in T2C which most multiboxer don't wanna tackle. Positioning requirements, attention to every single characters it is a must to survive these areas. I do it better and faster with my main in an actual raid group and with no headache. Unless of course you are talking areas such as the current "reputation" farm which is not gated nor stopping a solo to tag mobs and get credit for the kill and chance of loot. How does it go faster when items are not exactly a 100% drop.

Never used the term "good loot" and for the life of me can't make any sense of this in relation to anything I've ever said.

--H

P.S. How much gold did you make while you slept last night?

[watevaplz]

The vast majority of the boxers running gold farms that this thread addressed are using this program. That program has threads on its forums stating that SSG winks at it, and that its support staff (when it was Turbine) actually apologized and reinstated people "erroneously" banned for using it. Odd then that nobody talks about it here.


You have a penchant for putting words in people's mouths. I never said it was mandatory. That's nonsense. Just as I never blamed you as the cause of performance issues. Yet you repeat that over and over again as well. Because you can't address arguments that are actually being made, you address what you wish they were saying. Texbook straw men.


My god. Every economist who reads this would weep.

Yes prices go down on certain things that they farm en masse and flood the market (increasing supply decreases price).

But. . . the part you gloss over, is the tremendous amount of gold they generate both as they farm those items but also as a result of selling those items.

And those vast quantities of gold in the economy raise the price on the items that they generally don't/can't receive as a result of farming. That's the definition of inflation.

So, no, the hides that they lower the price on doesn't translate to a lower price on Anfalas Crystals, Scroll of Empowerment, Wild Essences, or other items that they then purchase with their vast quantities of multibox-farmed gold (that they worked so hard for while they watched Netflix and listened for a GM tell), but not farmed en masse themselves.

Perhaps the most dismaying part about the way that you argue is that you clearly don't take any time whatsoever to check your own arguments and instead leave it to others. Thus wasting all our time on bad arguments that you should have caught yourself before posting them.


Never used the term "good loot" and for the life of me can't make any sense of this in relation to anything I've ever said.

--H

P.S. How much gold did you make while you slept last night?

--> Ok let me wear my tin-foil hat? So what is the purpose of GM talking to me twice when I'm farming in areas? Just to say hi, grab a piece of that pie? Want that share of the gold? It is not common where players get banned for 3rd party programs that end up repealed due to false detection system. I was once put into jail because back then in moors there was a bug with hunter stealth and the GM put in prison then i told him it was sylvan shadows (which it was).

--> I have a base assumption that you keep repeating the need for 3rd party programs. In fact you even accuse me 3 times of using it. So now it surfaced again and you say "it is not mandatory"? Are you breaking away from this topic once again? For the 4th time?

--> Inflation is the introduction of MORE money into the cycle of economy ie buying products/necessities, increasing said value. In this game if someone is hoarding gold and not introducing it to the economy then how did it affect it. Are you assuming that all these gold farms they buy all these necessities such as wild essences, star lit that makes this items increase in value? That's totally false since all these "valued" items you speak of drastically decreased in value over time. Back then essences were 350g-400g , prior to U20 330g, now it is selling to 300g infact you can get 270g. If what you said is relatively true, shouldn't it go upwards?

I'm leaving my arguments to others? When was this?


It was enough to buy a large shrew, are you jealous?

Added note: Sorry not everyone is SLOW to press buttons (1-2-3), while chatting with a gm, lifting 2 weights, watching netflix, doing taxes, getting a massage while blindfolded. Of course it is an exaggeration but I hope you get the point.